Selective Memory Loss?

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Selective Memory Loss?

Postby |3lack|ce » Tue Feb 17, 2009 2:38 pm

Ok, first I'll post up the link, then I'll write thoughts on it - after reading the article it'll come clear why it's posted here and not in "News"

http://www.kltv.com/Global/story.asp?S=9854078

Erasing bad memories with a pill

EAST TEXAS (KLTV) - If you had the option, would you erase painful life experiences from your memory? A blood pressure pill may one day give patients the opportunity to do just that. We wanted to know if East Texans would use it...
"Do you have anything in your life, like a bad memory you just wish you could forget about," I asked.

"Yeah, like my marriage," replied Monet Deveraux.

"Some people might have things that were so traumatic it might be helpful to them, but I think most times the bad times are when you grow and learn the most," said Tom Moore.

"I have a lot of bad memories, said Beth Davis. "Getting left as a child. I got left on the Kansas City turnpike," she laughed.

"There's nothing I want to forget except mistakes I've made in life, you know," said Larry Johnigan. "Some choices I've made but other than that, but you learned from those. Oh yeah, I learned from those so I'm fine."

"Ex-relationships and bad things that happen from that," said Dustin Wilhelm. "{I } definitely want to remove those memories."

Of course, it does raise some issues, like, is it ethical to erase memories; even the most painful ones?

We explored deeper into this mind-boggling possibility...

The new dutch study examines a drug called propranolol. It's been used in lower doses to ease nerves. Now, dutch doctors say it worked on humans, blocking fearful memories of spiders.


Ok, so here we are, welcome to the world of "Selective Parkinsons" thanks to superior chemistry.

Now here's where it ties into moral and religious issues:

It is my adamant belief that who we are is made up of two things - Our memories, and how we choose to think and act based upon them.

Would YOU willingly give up a part of yourself, even the very worst part? I bloody well wouldn't.

Thoughts? Discussion?
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Re: Selective Memory Loss?

Postby Panama Red » Tue Feb 17, 2009 3:08 pm

The thought of selectively removing memories is frightening, I am sympathetic to those who have suffered extreme trauma (rape,physical abuse etc) and maybe this will be a blessing for them, but I just lost a relative who had Alzheimer's and there is nothing worse then seeing/talking to someone you love who don't recognize you or their immediate family.

Memories bad or good are "natural" and should be left alone, some of the music that we all love was brought about by painful memories, where would those songs be if the author had that painful memory erased. Same with artists who paint, they rely on a memory sometimes, or authors such as Dickens, now would we have such stories like Oliver or Great Expectations if these were based upon real life experiences and they were removed because they were painful?

I have some bad memories from when I was young, such as a pet being put down because he was shot, would I like that memory erased, no...as I then would probably forget about him completely, you have to take the bad with the good, you can learn to block out the bad over time and try to retain the good...

I think society is way over medicated to begin with and producing more sexy drugs only make the Pharmaceutical companies richer....plus we are slowly but surely eroding the ethical boundaries of medicine, you only have to see the recent news of that women with the octuplets and the fertility clinics....and eventually "designer babies".

Unfortunately this new procedure if it is 100% guaranteed to do the job will have customers... :breakfast:
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Re: Selective Memory Loss?

Postby dinowuff » Tue Feb 17, 2009 3:24 pm

Anyone who would do this should just be fucking shot. And their entire lineage should be considered as a threat to human existence. Who we are is defined by our actions, decisions and reactions of the past.

WTF - Say as a small child your parents poured boiling water on you. You take this pill. Now you're not going to be afraid of sticking your hand in a pot of boiling water?

DUMB ASSES!

Shoot them all and keep 'em out of the gene pool.
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Re: Selective Memory Loss?

Postby Aspman » Tue Feb 17, 2009 3:26 pm

I'm kinda with Red.

I can see that for traumatic events that are debilitating it COULD be beneficial to have those repressed. But at the the other end of it would it remove useful unpleasant events, burning your fingers on a match for example.

Plus there will be many example of events that seem traumatic but which you may wish to still have after you have recovered from them e,g, marriage breakups, death of a pet.

Then you will have people who will say that their traumatic events have changed their lives for the better.

I can see uses but it's a bit of a mindfield:)
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Re: Selective Memory Loss?

Postby Morganlefay » Tue Feb 17, 2009 3:35 pm

I am with Dino on this one

"When stupidity is no longer fatal...evolution ends"

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Re: Selective Memory Loss?

Postby Vorlin » Tue Feb 17, 2009 6:31 pm

I agree with Dino on this...we are today from the past and to erase selectively would be simply stupid. There is no good without bad, no right without wrong, etc...and to erase a bad memory and yet keep a good memory fails in comparison, IMHO. We've all have had bad memories from bad times but they wake us up to the good times. Those that want to block out bad memories don't need to be on this earth and the people creating something like this don't need to be on this earth either...play with Mother Nature and you're going to do nothing but piss her off.
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Re: Selective Memory Loss?

Postby Panama Red » Tue Feb 17, 2009 6:54 pm

Those that want to block out bad memories don't need to be on this earth


People who have been raped and or physically abused shouldn't try to block out the pain? (re:Memory) That is insane, maybe you should ask a few individuals who have experienced this if they would like to recreate in vivid detail the memory of the attack? Or better yet, ask them that if thanks to the wonders of medical science it is possible to block out that particular episode so that you can sleep at night would you be willing to take the red/blue pill...;)

I basically said I don't sanction medically altering peoples make up, but in that example I would be willing to make an exception.
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Re: Selective Memory Loss?

Postby dinowuff » Tue Feb 17, 2009 7:02 pm

God the more I think about this the sicker I get. And not many things scare the hell out of me.

Since everyone is using child rape these days to make money (Non-Profits charities) to making stupid laws (COPA which thankfully failed) Let's apply the fact that this happens to the scenario where the magic pill is available.

Time line:

Child is victim
Child takes pill
Child is no longer a victim.

Child does not know why some sex organ doesn't work
Doctor doesn't tell - two possible reasons
1 doesn't want to traumatize now young adult
2 took the pill and forgot

Now new law to protect children states any child victim or care giver of said victim. Parents, Family, Doctors, Police investigators and Judges - even jury members get the pill after all is said and done

No one remembers why the offender is in jail

Soon, no one ever remembers anyone ever raping a child so nothing is ever done to prevent it. Cause no one ever remembers it happening.

Don't screw with the memory!
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Re: Selective Memory Loss?

Postby |3lack|ce » Tue Feb 17, 2009 7:15 pm

Red, I have to agree with the opposition on that one -

ALL memories, even (and most especially) the most painful ones define who we ARE as individuals.

My most horrible memory was finding the best friend I had in this world charred beyond recognition, and carrying his corpse out of the fire that killed him and 46 other of my friends.

Was I traumatized by it? You betcha. In fact, I'm STILL getting therapy and it's 20 years after the fact as of 4/19. Would I take a pill to forget it if I could? No way in hell, and I'd kill the doctor that tried to push it onto me.

Now - does this mean that I'd have issues with a rape victim trying to forget her rapist, or a kid being treated so they'll forget they were molested?

Well, the truth is, yes, I would. Even in the harshest, most heinous parts of this world there is value - and the value to be found in those heinous parts is this: Do your absolute best to make sure it bloody well never happens again.

Forgetting about it is kinda like an Ostrich burying its head in the sand, and I'll damn well never be one of those, nor one of those bleeding hearted weenies who think that doing away with the immediate pain will cure the problem, nor one of those power-hungry Doctors out there who'd love to have the ability to control the masses. I'd envision a headline for you about a Dr that will be indicted for raping his female patients, but unfortunately with this drug he'll never worry about it again, they'll all forget it ever happened. Someone needs to go find these Dutch scientists and bring this research to a screaming halt, and it needs to be done fast.

I gotta go with Dino on his statement 'the more I think about this the more afraid I become.' - Here's a good TeeVee commercial from 2030 or so:

Announcer: "Have you taken your (insert amnesiotic here) yet today? President for life Blahblah, World Emperor and High Priest heartily endorses it for those happy feelgood feelings we all know and love! Remember, a day without (drugname) is a criminal offense! It's time to take your medicine and take away your pain!"
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Re: Selective Memory Loss?

Postby Panama Red » Tue Feb 17, 2009 7:22 pm

I can agree with that Dino, where children are involved, but for an adult who is raped as an adult, I can see where they would want to forget the experience,and as an adult would know that being raped is a bad thing so not having to rely on a personal experience can come to the same conclusion, and as an adult they are ultimately responsible for their action, so if they want to take the pill, then it's going to happen.When that White n Wooly Sunday lunch on legs was cloned the genie was pretty much let out of the lamp, and as we have seen with irresponsible fertility clinic Dr's (loosely applied here), it's no longer life imitating art, it's now more like art is imitating life..as in Hollywood and the media, and or 15 minutes of fame...along with the drop in and drop out crowds....

I also would be terrified if the "state" saw a need to sanction the use at the Institutional level, then it's a dangerous thing, but so is chemical castration and lobotomies...and yet they are still doing these things... :wink:

Just so we are clear on this, I too agree with the majority here, with the one small exception I mentioned in the case of adults. What I would like to see them do instead of trying to wipe memories, how about a cure for Alzheimer's and the restoration of memories, now would that be ethically the right thing to do or are some things better left alone?
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Re: Selective Memory Loss?

Postby Aspman » Thu Feb 19, 2009 12:24 pm

It's all bollocks and misrepresentation

http://scienceblogs.com/notrocketscienc ... mories.php
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Re: Selective Memory Loss?

Postby Morganlefay » Thu Feb 19, 2009 4:02 pm

^great site Asp!!! :good:

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Re: Selective Memory Loss?

Postby Aspman » Thu Feb 19, 2009 4:43 pm

< Science geek Image

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Re: Selective Memory Loss?

Postby Panama Red » Thu Feb 19, 2009 11:22 pm

Aspman wrote:It's all bollocks and misrepresentation

http://scienceblogs.com/notrocketscienc ... mories.php



lol...well that's that settled, fecking media.... :evil:
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