A discussion on U.S. Polotics

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A discussion on U.S. Polotics

Postby dinowuff » Sat Oct 19, 2013 8:20 pm

Republicans are Red
Democrats are Blue
The U.S. Government doesn't give a shit about you!

For those of you that are not living in the U.S. and are not U.S. Citizens - what do you think about all this shutdown, non bill paying, lying, cheating, bullshitting stuff that's in the news lately? Or are you so busy trying to figure out your own bullshit government that you don't give a shit about the U.S government.

DISCUSS:
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AND I WANT TO KNOW WHY NOT!
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Re: A discussion on U.S. Polotics

Postby DaFoxx » Sat Oct 19, 2013 11:27 pm

UK based and kind of lost as to why any government would allow a $20 TRILLION debt to just spiral upwards, at a rate of around $1 TRILLION a year
and from here, you have elected a president, yet are able to block the major factor of his win ........... Obama care

we have NHS, it is broken, needs fixing, but no one here would agree to removing it, we just need to tighten it up a LOT
US doesn't seem to have any form of free at point of contact health service at all, but does have everything else in spades

so if someone US side could add their take, and if they have any affiliation D / R say that too please

we need to improve our military, and stop our overseas aid, at present UK has a larger % of GDP to just give away then any fecker out there
US gives more, but as a % of what you actually earn is less, yet you spend WAY more on defence than we do, again, as a % of GDP, the total you spend will never be touched by us, but why, if we wish to remain as a special relationship with US can we not at least attempt to put more troops in boots so we have some to actually be with you in both spirit AND body

I used to think US was just a bigger more open version of UK
but what I see and read is that US has a BIG issue with religion, allowing it to sway almost all aspects of their political life

I am no fan of France, but they DO keep the two SEPERATE, as did Turkey, well, at least until the present incumbent there who is trying to bring religion more into play too

from my perspective, US needs to do some serious thinking about where it wants to GO
NOT where it has BEEN
we have eyes in our head looking forward, we should all do that, if we had been designed to look back, then that is where the eyes would be

there is a world out there that is not a lover of US anything, and even those countries with whom you think you have an alliance with, will fail you if you keep trying to push your way to the front, the world is changing, China IS a massive economy, but it is not yet spread in depth through its population, India too is a massive economy, but they have damn nigh ZERO push through of their economy past the old established lines

US economy is #1 with deep penetration of wealth, yes, you can have VERY rich, and VERY poor people, but you, most importantly have a massive number of people who can afford to live and buy goods, and that is why you are allowed to build an inexcusable amount of debt

but I would LOVE to see those people who said the 'West' should let those 'poor' countries forgo their debt, that we should allow them to start afresh

strangely, not heard from them saying US should be allowed to 'just' do that .........
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Re: A discussion on U.S. Polotics

Postby rapier57 » Sun Oct 20, 2013 2:49 am

My hope is that we experience a voter revolt in the next couple elections.

US politics are hard to understand, even for insiders. What this last bunch of events and grandstanding amounts to is the following:

1. The radical far right teabaggers (Tea Party), also known as the totally insane, just have this issue with anyone having any kind of health care, even if they pay for it themselves. The US Affordable Care Act sets up a basic minimum set of standards for health insurance coverage, extends the public Medicaid program for the poor, and allows anyone to buy health insurance on an even playing field. No one can be refused (though some are being rejected for some reason), and the health insurance provided by employers has to meet the same set of standards. That is it in a nutshell. The idiot teabaggers think this is socialized medicine and Canadian or UK style health care and have vowed to repeal it. Not even close. Only the poor are subsidized.

2. The teabaggers made promises to their sadly misinformed constituency to repeal the ACA and have attempted to do so through a number of weird and underhanded methods until they came up with the totally insane brainstorm of tying defunding ACA to continued federal funding and debt ceiling raising. Then they said the President refused to compromise. But, the whole purpose of the manipulation was to establish a govern-by-crisis protocol, even when the crisis is artificial. It also attempted to establish a tyranny by minority that would hold a gun to the head of the other branches of government to get what it wants.

Thankfully, it did not work.

To understand some of the machinations, you also have to understand the constitutional roles of each branch of our government. The President is required to present a budget to congress at the beginning of each fiscal cycle. The House of Representatives is the holder of the national purse strings and will hammer out the budget bill. The Senate either accepts and votes on the bill, or makes some adjustments and sends it back. Eventually, both houses agree and send the budget to the President for signature. That is supposed to be the process. The annual federal funding continuation is supposed to be an automatic approval resolution that keeps the paychecks going.

The teabaggers and other Republicans in the House are actually the ones that created much of the current budget bloat through the normal budget process over several administrations. Why they made a big fuss now, and tried to tie it to ACA is just nuts. They created it, now they have a tantrum about it.

The solution seems to be to vote those crazies out of office. Based on recent polls, none of the House or Senate incumbents should feel any kind of job security over the next few election cycles. The Republicans probably do not stand a snowball's chance in a hot place to have any potential candidate win the presidency in the near future. The People (as per our constitution) still retain rights and powers not specifically granted to the States or the Federal government. And, we may have to use those to correct the situation.

My worry, based on recent conversations with other citizens, is that citizens don't have a clue what the constitution says, that is was established by "we the people," or what powers are granted to Congress, the President, the Supreme Court, the States. And, they just don't understand the primary role of the government (provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity). The problem is that a lot of folks get their information from Fox News (I call it Fox Not-The_News).

But, to get a better historical perspective on why we are where we are with the national budget, military spending and other things, a great book for insight is Ike's Bluff: President Eisenhower's Secret Battle to Save the World, by Evan Thomas. Excellent biography of the Eisenhower presidency and historical background of the post-WWII and atomic history. This gave me a lot of insight into why the "military industrial complex" got control of the government after Ike. Good read.

OK, back to your regular programming.
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Re: A discussion on U.S. Polotics

Postby Panama Red » Fri Oct 25, 2013 10:49 pm

So far so good, no one has cottoned onto our plant Ted Cruz (Alberta boy) as the future of America and once in power he will name the US of A the 11th Province of Canada...wooohooo


All kidding aside, please please do not send that wacko back to Canada, I love the level of ineptitude displayed by the Republicans every time they bring up the fairy tale of Obama not being American and his Dad is a Kenyan and here is Ted Cruz a Canadian by birth, to a father who was a pal of Castro (hows that for Irony stupid)...so Obama is supposedly a Muslim, what does that make Ted Cruz? A Communist? Reagan will be turning over in his grave...Lol

I think the Tea Party individuals treaded lightly on the ice of treason, by holding the Government to extortion and the citizenry at bay is in my mind very un American, this is not 1776 for christs sake....by pulling that stunt of forcing the Government to close they have set in motion a domino effect with regards to peoples livelihoods...very unprofessional and as Rapier says come the fall of 2014 a lot of these douche bags will be replaced, an angry constituency is very powerful. I just hope the Democrats keep reminding people all year long right up to the elections...

The Republicans are the party of the last few WASP's and it's coming home to roost against them, they will be the fringe party unless they can rid themselves of the Hillbillies and evangelical wing nuts and bring some semblance of order to their party, until then we will continue to see and hear Republicans like Palin/Bachmann and a few other's that should not have been elected to a PTA group let alone the Government.

Lastly I think the standards of entry into becoming a Politician in the US need to be tightened up, like they should all be required to excel in the countries history, if asked about Paul Revere they should be able to quote the story verbatim, also they should be required to leave the bible at home along with their beliefs...keep it out of politics...now is the time for the Democrats to shock and awe the rest of the Southern States and insist that religion be taken out of the classrooms unless it is part of a Civics class...
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Re: A discussion on U.S. Polotics

Postby rapier57 » Sat Oct 26, 2013 5:04 am

Thanks, Panama, for that information. It never occured to me that he was Canadian-born. Still, his parents are US Citizens, er, one was? Anyway, I find it interesting that his wife worked in the W White House for Condoleeza Rice (scarey person) and now works for Goldman, Sachs and Co. Yeah, they got it all by hard work.

Right.

BS.
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Re: A discussion on U.S. Polotics

Postby chaosclown » Sun Oct 27, 2013 4:18 pm

I was never one for politics. I usually don't get involved at all..........But these views are completely different from what I am used to hearing in my area of the States. It irks me that people in my area can take a single tid bit of information and seemingly base an uneducated guess, which then becomes the basis of their very strong opinions of how the government should be ran and that Obama is a complete tool. Again I tend to stay away from politics but now, I really want to learn more about what's going on.....
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Re: A discussion on U.S. Polotics

Postby DaFoxx » Sun Oct 27, 2013 8:51 pm

chaosclown wrote:I was never one for politics. I usually don't get involved at all.............

sadly, this is always true in ANY country where the vote is in place, and the society has had time to 'mature'
people elsewhere are prepared to die to win the right to vote, to be able to participate, in no matter how small a way, with the selection process that will oversee their lives
not a critique of OP, just a general observation, I have always voted, since mid 70's, as I think it should be compulsory to do so, even though it has always been said that for the UK to guarantee a Labour victory every time, put the ballot box in bars, not in schools, so maybe not the best outcome for my slightly to the right of Attila the Hen :mrgreen: views, but you get my point

we may not like what we have, but at least we have a chance to change it every few years or so

allegedly :P
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Re: A discussion on U.S. Polotics

Postby Egaladeist » Tue Oct 29, 2013 11:55 am

Make no mistake the US is an Empire....and just like any Empire of the past, eventually it caves in on itself from inside. It's inevitable and unavoidable, the question isn't ' if ' , the only question is ' when '.

I personally see another WW coming, maybe not in my lifetime, but definitely in my kids lifetime. The US economy collapsing from massive debt, China emerging as the next economic Superpower, Russia getting nervous over an economic and military buildup by it's neighbor, Japan's long animosity toward China exasperated by the same and it's own declining economy, China becoming emboldened by it's new status as the World's foremost Superpower to renew it's desire to take control of Taiwan and the Japanese-controlled islands in the East China Sea, well...you know how that goes...

think this is socialized medicine and Canadian or UK style health care and have vowed to repeal it. Not even close. Only the poor are subsidized.


The reason our Health Care System isn't just for the poor is to avoid a two-tiered system, the problem with having a two-tiered system is that, eventually, the quality of care for the poor diminishes. This does not prevent rich people from seeking private healthcare abroad, in fact many rich people have doctors in the US. What our system , in Country, does prevent is having one class of service for the rich and another lower class level of service for the poor. Healthcare is seen as a fundamental right in Canada that all people should be entitled, regardless of wealth, to the same quality service. Rich people are in no way, as mentioned, obligated to participate, they are free to seek specialized or personal heath care elsewhere if they want to, our system in no way impedes their ability to do so...in fact, in many cases our system provides for it, Health Canada does have a procedure to apply for subsidized health care abroad.

And it's not free...we pay for it... :mrgreen:
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Re: A discussion on U.S. Polotics

Postby DaFoxx » Tue Nov 12, 2013 3:23 pm

just to add to the general talk in regards to the REAL power behind the throne as it were

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